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Veepstakes

14 Jun 2007 01:24 pm

Sure, it's too early, but Marc Ambinder floats Mark Warner on the Democratic side and Mike Huckabee for the GOP. Both are from the South, which makes a certain sense, given that this is likely to be the first Presidential election since 1988 when neither candidate hailed from Dixie - or since 1984, if you count George H.W. Bush as a Texan. I'm pretty skeptical, though, of the notion that "regional balance" is a particularly important value for a campaign to seek these days. It made more sense in an era when political parties were uneasy, ideologically-diverse coalitions, and when machines could really deliver a state to a candidate: Picking Lyndon Baines Johnson as his running mate, for instance, pretty clearly helped put JFK over the top in '60, whether you believe there was fraud in Texas or not. Nowadays, though, the parties are more ideologically coherent, and regional loyalties are more attenuated; hence John Edwards' failure to help John Kerry in the South in '04, and Al Gore's failure to carry his home state four years earlier.

It seems to me that what you're looking for these days is a nominee who gives you a narrative that the media can embrace, more than one who gives you a slight boost in a swing state or region. Thus Gore was a good pick for Clinton in '92, even though they were both Southerners, because he reinforced the whole "New Democrats, new generation, new direction" theme that the press ran with throughout that election. Similarly, I think that Dick Cheney and Joe Lieberman helped their respective tickets in '00, even though neither Wyoming nor Connecticut mattered to the outcome: Cheney by lending necessary gravitas to a campaign premised on restoring honor, dignity and so forth; Lieberman both by being the first Jewish nominee and by having a reputation as a Clinton critic, which at once turned the dull-seeming Gore into a trailblazer and helped him distance himself from the Clinton scandals. I know Democrats soured on Lieberman in '00 because of his debate performance and what they perceived as his weakness during the recount, but picking him gave Gore an enormous boost that August, and helped the Democrats close what had been an impressive Bush lead in the polls.

Obviously there's no way of knowing how things will play out this time around. But here's one example of what I mean: If Barack Obama wins the Democratic nomination, he has an interest in picking a Southern running mate (like Mark Warner, say) less because the pick might help Obama carry some Southern states than because the narrative that such a pick projects - a black candidate with a white running mate from the old Confederacy! - dovetails perfectly with Obama's "beyond our differences" appeal.

Comments (28)

Ross,
I think this post is fundamentally correct and well-argued, but Sen. Lieberman was a poor choice in 2000 even before his mismanagement of recount strategy. He had to submerge a number of his own policy positions and inclinations in order to promote the Gore agenda, and he so wasn't a persuasive advocate for a progressive vision, even though he was a pathbreaking and highly qualified candidate. In fact, his trailblazing status, which received loads of coverage and around which he largely constructed his (somewhat inspiring) speeches, obscured this lack of fit, preventing it from being addressed, as it otherwise could have been had the campaign decided at some point to give him a more discernable message of policy or anti-Bush advocacy, and I think the Gore campaign suffered as a result.

"Qualified to be president" ought to fit somewhere in this argument. VP Cheney then, and now, strikes me as qualified to be president; Sen. Lieberman also struck me as qualified to be president. Neither Gov. Huckabee nor Gov. Warner immediately give off that "qualified" vibe--though maybe they will in a year. How about Rep. Hunter and Sen. Biden?

I understand and agree with the point that regional balance has become far less important than in days past; but unlike Edwards, who was a vaguely popular Senator, Warner was a ridiculously popular governor, leaving office with approval ratings well above 60% (I think they were near 70,) and helping a similar candidate win in 2005. Warner might be a good choice for purely regional reasons: VA is becoming more blue, and Warner can deliver VA (unlike Edwards in NC), and with a win in VA, the Dems almost certainly win the election.

I stopped believing the Vice Presidential nominee had any effect after 1988 and Dan Quayle.

That said, if it has an impact at all, I think Ross has put his finger on what the impact would be.

Sam
I don't think its a guarantee Warner delivers VA. VA went roughly 60% for the SSM amendment. Bush carried it by a decent margin both times and but for Allen's macaca gaffe and a few other miscues he probably pulls out pretty resounding win. I just don't see moderate Virginians jumping on board a platform promising universal healthcare and a dovish foreign policy, no matter who is running on the bottom half of the ticket.

...Cheney by lending necessary gravitas to a campaign premised on restoring honor, dignity and so forth...

Really blows your mind in retrospect, doesn't it?

I could be wrong, but, should Obama do reasonably well but not win the nomination, I suspect it will be very difficult to keep him off the ticket.

When you have trouble keeping someone off the bottom half of your ticket, isn't that a sign that you lack the authority to be president? Cf. Kerry-Edwards.

Anonymous Conservative, the issue is going to be the further divide between Northern and Southern Virginia. A candidate like McCain or Giuliani who won't be able to turn out the huge numbers of Southern Virginian voters is at serious risk of losing the state to Warner. I think Warner runs as a technocratic policy wonk, who talks a lot about technology: pretty much how he governed in VA. Maybe the foreign policy allows the Republican to win again, but I don't think universal health care is going to be a turn off.

Mix "universal healthcare" and "Hillary Clinton" and you have socialism, in the perception of legions of American voters. That alone is going to get people out to vote, as is the reelection campaign of the deservedly popular John Warner. Unless it's a Democratic landslide, Virginia is not a likely pickup.

As a Virginia resident, I also don't see Mark Warner as VP flipping the Commonwealth into the Democratic column. He obviously left office popular, but I don't think he's going to make otherwise GOP leaning voters forget about the top of the ticket. He only had one term and isn't really a "native son." Virginia could vote Democratic in 2008, but only as part of a landslide. It won't be the difference maker.

Ed Rendell would lock up Pennsylvania and possibly Ohio. Bill Richardson, who I think is most likely pick, would lock up New Mexico and could help the Dems in states like Arizona, Nevada, and Colorado.

One "outside the box" possibility I've thought about for Obama would be Sam Nunn. He'd certainly help on the gravitas and foreign policy/defense concerns. Though, he has not been in the Senate for a while, and I have doubts that the liberal wing of the Democrats would approve.

On the Republican side, the press is going to be eager to paint them as being "stuck in the 1950s" compared to the woman/minority Democratic nominee. Kay Bailey Hutchinson would be a solid VP pick for the GOP.

VaGuy,
Among the Republicans Pawlenty would be a nice pick. If you nominate someone like Rudy you'll probably need to go pretty conservative with the bottom half of the ticket. Hutchinson is still a bit more of a centrist than a lot of the base would like to balance that out. Huckabee's a solid bet.

hukcabee's spent like a drunken sailer pardoned futuer murderers, raised taxes, tried to nationalize chidl reareing and tried hard to push the legislature into giving tuition to illegal aiens.

are abortions and "moral values" the only issues that define conservatism now? I'm conservative on them myself-particular the former-but Hutchinson not even that liberal!

What makes you think the GOP VP won't be Cheney again?

There's no rule that he has to run for President. Why bother, that would be a step down - he'd be unable to operate in secrecy as well as he does now, and he'd gain little or no additional power.

Douthat writes Lieberman . . . helped him distance himself from the Clinton scandals.

All you serious media pundits still don't understand that Gore would have won if he had made more use of Clinton's tremendous outside-the-beltway popularity?

Laney
Clinton was something of a third rail at that point. Not only was he scandal-ridden, a label that has ebbed in memory over time, he was also infinitely more charismatic than Gore, who comes across as a condescending high school science teacher. This will be an obstacle for Hillary too, which is why they often campaign separately.

I think Ross's point is fundamentally correct here, but would argue that the specific demands of modern campaigning call for a VP candidate whose ideological and policy precriptions closely track those of the presidential candidate, and whose campaigning skills are such that he or she serves as an effective and vocal cog within the campaign's media machine. I think Cheney was enormously effective in the role of campaign pitbull: he could aggressively attack Kerry as part of Rove's seamless media strategy.

Contrast that to Edwards, who had a nice resume as a primary candidate, but whose campaign skills were soft, unfocused, and largely unhelpful against the coordinated Republican attack Kerry faced. Edwards wasn't ready to slug it out on Kerry's behalf, in part because I suspect he was always a bit more worried about his own political future than Kerry's.

In many ways, Cheney is the ideal VP for a modern campaign: sharply partisan, unconcerned with his own political future, and closely in tune with Bush on policy and ideology. He is an attack dog with a strong enough personality to break through the media haze and score points for his man. If I were running a campaign, I would look for someone similar as my VP.

Owenz
I think ideological affinity is overrated. Bush and Cheney were actually quite different, one the compassionate conservative and the other hardbitten, cynical Beltway insider. Bush didn't share Cheney's foreign policy and I doubt Cheney shared Bush's particular affection for NCLB or other pet programs. And Reagan-Bush were very different, one the idealist and the other the very cynical realist, so different in fact that their respective foreign policies are usually taught as examples of opposing schools. Someone with pro-life bonafides could explain to voters why a candidate like Rudy is actually not bad for right-to-lifers and be believable in doing so. Yes a measure of common ground is necessary and as you highlight a willingness to be rather merciless in attacking the opposing camp can be a strong positive too, but I don't buy that the candidates need to share identical policy preferences to be an effective tandem.

Yes a measure of common ground is necessary and as you highlight a willingness to be rather merciless in attacking the opposing camp can be a strong positive too, but I don't buy that the candidates need to share identical policy preferences to be an effective tandem.

You make a great point. I don't think idealogy is that important, now that you mention it. It boils down to something simpler: loyalty. Dedication to the cause. A willingness to subvert one's own ambitions for the greater good of victory.

The problem with someone like Hillary drafting, say, Obama, as VP, is that Obama has his own set of extremely healthy political ambitions that he may or may not be willing to subvert in favor of Hillary. Ideologically, they are pretty close...but I'm just not sure Obama would carry her water when Hillary moves to the right for the general. Will he do the dance with the kind of gusto that's required?

And hey, maybe a guy like Warner, who created some buzz among Democrats but seemed to fizzle a bit under the bright lights is a good fit for Obama or Hillary. But he reminds of Edwards...a feel-good kind of guy whose preaching a positive message. I'd prefer someone more partisan, who's a good deal fiestier. The right VP would need to be willing shift rightwards on policy matters while employing ruthless partisan tactics.

Conversely, a guy like Rudy, who has no shortage of fiestyness on his own, might benefit from a Huckabee, who provides more traditional conservative values in an easily digestible package. The question is whether Huckabee could stomach carrying Rudy's water on social issues when his views so plainly differ with Rudy's.

Good points all around. As a semi-Virginian I like Warner but he managed to accomplish what he did here by appealing across partisan lines. I don't think he or his wife have the heart for a vicious campaign. Someone like Gephardt or Richardson, who is experienced if not necessarily vicious and whose electoral ceiling is limited by much of what Ryan Lizza wrote in his recent TNR piece, would seem to fit the criteria you enumerate.

Re: I just don't see moderate Virginians jumping on board a platform promising universal healthcare and a dovish foreign policy, no matter who is running on the bottom half of the ticket.

You may be right about a "dovish" foreign policy in general, though opposition to the Iraq debacle is pretty general through the nation now, except for the hard-core GOP base. And since when universal healthcare unpopular? Granted specific proposals can be "Harry-and-Louised" to death but as a general goal it's up there with Mom and Apple Pie, and it helped Bill Clinton get elected back in 92. Anybody so far right that voting against universal healthcare would be their cause d'etre is already a voter who would not vote Democratic if Jesus and St. Peter were the candidates.

Re: What makes you think the GOP VP won't be Cheney again?

Well, if the GOP wants to lose they'd nominate him. He's even less popular than Bush, and is seen as embodying all the worst things about the Bush administration.

Re: Obama has his own set of extremely healthy political ambitions that he may or may not be willing to subvert in favor of Hillary.

Why would he have to subvert them? He's a pretty young guy and having "vice president" on his resume sets him up as an even better canduidate in the future.

Universal healthcare would be a catastrophe in this country. Try selling voters in Northern Virginia, including an overrepresentation of military retirees, that the government needs to play a greater role in healthcare, that military medicine and the VA constitute models, and they will rightly tell you that you're out of your mind when they cast their ballots. Saying the healthcare system is broke is a tawdry truism, likely to win votes. Saying that you have a concrete proposal to make it better is not, because any plan put forth will be shot full of holes inside of a week.

Re: Universal healthcare would be a catastrophe in this country.

I think you are confusing universal healthcare with single payor (AKA "socialized medicine"), as in Canada. No one serious is proposing the latter. The former (which could be done through the market) polls extremely well even among social conservatives and is nowadays pushed by a number of Republicans too (see: Romney, Schwartzenewggar and even John McCain).

The plans vary widely considering they all fall under the same moniker. If you ensure that people will have care whether or not they pay for it, they will not pay for it. Call it economics, call it common sense.

Sometimes the VP can diminish the President. I remember seeing Bob Dole and Jack Kemps speak and thinking why is Kemp #2? Generally the Veep plays the role of administration attack dog and trial balloon floater. Also there is often an effort to "balance the ticket."

Huckabee'd work well for McCain or Guiliani. He's socially conservative and seems to be quick on his feet. Romney or Thompson would want Guiliani to balance their "conservative" persona I would think.

On the Democrat side it's kind of hard to see how it shakes out. I think James Webb would work better for Obama, still from the old confederacy but tough and with National Security cred. Beyond our differences and ready for the big job. If Hillary gets it she has a tougher narrative to fill. Richardson should be in the running but hasn't shown himself ready. Gore seems to be tough enough now, but Clinton/Gore '08 seems odd. Edwards is going to have everyone hating his guts when it is over. Maybe she might look for a diplomat or someone with peacemaking cred to show she's ready to do the whole Smart Power thing (building on the "she's ready to hit the ground running in the scary times we live in" theme). I could see either of them fleshing out a shadow cabinet in the second half of 08 assuming Bush continues to implode.

Gear up for grub with a tripleheader of pigskin, including a meeting of brothers in Dallas. Everybody knows it's been a rough year for her, but find out who else had issues

Gear up for grub with a tripleheader of pigskin, including a meeting of brothers in Dallas. Everybody knows it's been a rough year for her, but find out who else had issues

Clinton has taken Kentucky and Obama is right there in Oregon.
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http://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/05/20/primary.wrap/index.html

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