« Prostitution, Morality and the Law | Main | Prostitution and Promiscuity »

The Costs Of Living

13 Mar 2008 08:09 am

suburb.jpg

Ezra writes:

… I was looking at some family income distribution numbers yesterday and was a bit surprised by how the distribution looked. To enter the Top 20 percent, you need to be making $88,000 a year. To enter the Top 5 percent, you need to make $157,000 a year. I've known a lot of families making around $150,000, and none of them would have described themselves as much beyond upper middle class, or "doing pretty well." And though I'd call Top 5 percent rich, in income terms, I probably would have said $250,000.

In response, Matt makes some good points about the crudeness of family income as a metric of actual wealth. I would add that geographical variations in the cost of living make an enormous difference as well, and one obvious reason why a family of Ezra’s acquaintance making around $150,000 annually might not describe themselves as rich would be that, well, they probably aren’t - at least not if they live in the greater New York or Washington or Los Angeles area, where the cost of living is far too high for 150 grand to buy the kind of lifestyle that most Americans associate with being wealthy.

I would also note that when I say the “cost of living” I really mean the “cost of raising children,” since a childless couple in NYC or DC making $150,000 annually enjoys a vastly different lifestyle than a couple trying to raise 2 or 3 school-age children on the same salary. This distinction is worth pondering in the context of the debate over whether conservatives should push for child-friendly tax policy; it’s also worth pondering the context of the desuburbanization agenda beloved of progressives nowadays. You’ll frequently hear Ezra and Matt, among others, lamenting the latticework of subsidies and tax breaks that incentivize Americans to buy biggish homes in spread-out suburbs and exurbs, rather than clustering more efficiently in inner-ring ‘burbs, medium-sized towns and urban cores. But of course these policies don’t just redistribute people from energy-saving cities to gas-guzzling exurbs; they also effectively redistribute money away from the singletons, childless couples and small families who are more likely to be drawn to urban areas, and to the larger families that are more likely to be drawn to bigger yards, quieter streets, and houses with 3-5 bedrooms.

Obviously, if you’re the sort of progressive (or conservative) who doesn’t think the government should show any pro-family bias at all, you won’t have a problem with a policy agenda that eliminates this sort of redistribution. And just as obviously, there may be more effective (and energy-efficient) ways to make it easier for parents to raise the next generation of taxpaying Americans: I’d happily combine a Ponnuru-style tax reform with, say, congestion pricing on highways and a smaller home-mortgage deduction. (And making it easier to build in urban areas is a good idea, period.) But all things being equal, it’s worth keeping in mind what when progressives talk about fighting sprawl and incentivizing re-urbanization, they’re often talking about making it vastly more expensive to raise kids the way most Americans want to raise them.

Photo by Flickr user PeterBaker used under a Creative Commons license.

Comments (12)

"This distinction is worth pondering in the context of the debate over whether conservatives should push for child-friendly tax policy"

I am utterly unable to "ponder" any rational basis for forcibly redistributing income from those who do not have children to those who do.

one obvious reason why a family of Ezra’s acquaintance making around $150,000 annually might not describe themselves as rich would be that, well, they probably aren’t - at least not if they live in the greater New York or Washington or Los Angeles area, where the cost of living is far too high for 150 grand to buy the kind of lifestyle that most Americans associate with being wealthy.

Wikipedia puts the median household income in NYC at $38,293 and LA at $36,687. So yes, if you live there and make $150,000, you're rich. On the bottom end of "rich" sure, and no one's going to confuse you with Bill Gates anytime soon, but you're doing better than almost 95% of the US population. (To paraphrase a commenter on Matt's blog, "if you score in the 95th percentile on a standardized test, are you smart? Same thing.") Your cost of living is higher, but what you're doing is using your money to buy the good "living in NYC/LA."

The thing I've learned from this topic, and in particular the comment thread for Matt's post, is how astoundingly out of touch some people are. My parents raised a family of five on 40k/year, and I knew plenty of people with less. They own a 4 bedroom house, which today, with all us kids gone, they've almost paid off. A house not in a suburb, but in a mid-sized midwestern city. (Yep, one doesn't need to live in a suburb to own a house. Cities aren't entirely made of high-rise condos, you know. Sure, we had a smaller backyard, so we walked to the bloody park.)

I'm sure those talking about the trials and tribulations of "getting by" on 100k/year are astonished to think that whole families can be raised on such a pittance. You own used cars, you own old furniture, you buy your groceries from discount stores, eating out is a rare treat and that new plasma TV are straight out. But it can be done, and most Americans do it their whole lives.

Look, I don't begrudge people their money. I'm a liberal, so I expect you to pay your taxes, but after that, do whatever the hell you want. I make a pretty good living myself, and do own a new car, a plasma TV, shop at some high-end stores, and go out to eat all the time. But I at least have the self-awareness to realize how fortunate I am. Sheesh.

Sorry, I'm admittedly taking out my anger at the thread on Matt's blog over here. :-)

To add a little complexity here, I would note that raising more than two kids in the suburbs is difficult because living in the suburbs depends on car transportation, and most cars can seat at most two or three children. I live in a neighborhood of Boston that was once thought of "lace curtain Irish," and in the 1950s many houses on my street had a half-dozen children or more. That was workable because no one had to drive the kids anywhere: they walked or took buses to school and to church, and you could get around the city by bus or subway.

What evidence is there that families are, all else being equal, attracted to the outer-suburban lifestyle? I.e., how do you know that existing subsidies are making it easier for American families to live where they want to live anyway, rather than pushing them toward a lifestyle that they might not otherwise prefer?

Matt Y makes this poit more clearly:

On top of all this, we're just past the great urban crisis years of the 1970s and 80s. These days, I worry much less that America's great cities will be rendered unviable than that the urban lifestyle is unaffordable for too many people. If you look at housing prices it's clear that "home in a walkable urban area close to a quality mass transit system" is a product that's in very high demand. Nobody needs to do anything to convince more people to want to live in situations like that. What's needed is for the price of situations like that to be cheap enough for more people to get them. That means some combination of allowing developers to build more units (taller buildings, laxer parking requirements) close to mass transit stations and building more mass transit stations.

The upshot of a situation like that wouldn't be to kill off suburbs at all. Rather, by draining the suburbs of people who actually would prefer to live elsewhere, what'll be left is a situation wherein people who prefer suburbia can more easily afford to live in the very best bits of it rather than in far-flung areas with bad commutes.

I am utterly unable to "ponder" any rational basis for forcibly redistributing income from those who do not have children to those who do.

Sustainability of the social structure and the welfare state? In the long run, those who do have kids definitely subsidize those who don't, while Social Security and such essentially force a lower reward for the investment in someone to take care of you in old age. That is, the contemporary state equalizes the risk pool for old age of having nobody who gives a flip if you live or die, and this doesn't really work if nobody has any kids. That's one (shorthand and debatable) argument in a nutshell. Imagination and reflection can supply others.

"You’ll frequently hear Ezra and Matt, among others, lamenting the latticework of subsidies and tax breaks that incentivize Americans to buy biggish homes in spread-out suburbs and exurbs, rather than clustering more efficiently in inner-ring ‘burbs, medium-sized towns and urban cores. But of course these policies don’t just redistribute people from energy-saving cities to gas-guzzling exurbs; they also effectively redistribute money away from the singletons, childless couples and small families who are more likely to be drawn to urban areas, and to the larger families that are more likely to be drawn to bigger yards, quieter streets, and houses with 3-5 bedrooms."

But there's a self-fulfilling prophecy here: when government encourages Americans to move to the exurbs, only the singletons will be willing to live anywhere else. So in the most bombed-out cities (e.g. Cleveland) the only well-off people in the city are singles, and even singles live in the suburbs more often than not.

But if you repopulate the cities, you create a virtuous circle: when enough affluent families are in the city, you have enough well-raised kids to support good private schools (e.g. DC), and when even MORE affluent families are in the city, you have enough well-raised kids to support a good public neighborhood school or two.

Is that the same Michael Lewyn of "Why Spawl is a Conservative Issue"? I do hope so!" It's a fantastic piece.


"But all things being equal, it’s worth keeping in mind what when progressives talk about fighting sprawl and incentivizing re-urbanization, they’re often talking about making it vastly more expensive to raise kids the way most Americans want to raise them."

As Lewyn's piece (http://www.repamerica.org/news/GEvol6/ge6.1_sprawl1.html) eloquently contends, conservatives, too, do and ought to fight sprawl.

Moreover, perhaps most Americans need to reconsider how they want to raise their children?

Notre Dame Professor of Architecture Phil Bess has a splendid piece on the New Urbanist Transect and Aristo-Thomism well worth the while for conservatives. http://64.143.51.61/Texts/The%20Polis%20and%20NL-Center%2015%20rev.pdf

Also, those houses ain't got no soul! They're the electronic drums of housing stock.

The point about the unaffordability of is something worth further consideration. I'm currently in a graduate program in urban planning, and for all the talk of the benefits of mixed-use design (which I wholly support), no one seems to have any substantial answers to the questions not only about keeping situation those whom gentrification stands to push out, but also about how to "gentrify" in a way that brings people of various economic levels in together, to wit, yuppies-to-be still in graduate school (Walking distance to campus notwithstanding, I hate my current suburban accommodations!), couples who want to offer an urban upbringing to their children.

Is that the same Michael Lewyn of "Why Sprawl is a Conservative Issue"? I do hope so!" It's a fantastic piece.


"But all things being equal, it’s worth keeping in mind what when progressives talk about fighting sprawl and incentivizing re-urbanization, they’re often talking about making it vastly more expensive to raise kids the way most Americans want to raise them."

As Lewyn's piece (http://www.repamerica.org/news/GEvol6/ge6.1_sprawl1.html) eloquently contends, conservatives, too, do and ought to fight sprawl.

Moreover, perhaps most Americans need to reconsider how they want to raise their children?

Notre Dame Professor of Architecture Phil Bess has a splendid piece on the New Urbanist Transect and Aristo-Thomism well worth the while for conservatives. http://64.143.51.61/Texts/The%20Polis%20and%20NL-Center%2015%20rev.pdf

Also, those houses ain't got no soul! They're the electronic drums of housing stock.

The point about the unaffordability of is something worth further consideration. I'm currently in a graduate program in urban planning, and for all the talk of the benefits of mixed-use design (which I wholly support), no one seems to have any substantial answers to the questions not only about keeping situation those whom gentrification stands to push out, but also about how to "gentrify" in a way that brings people of various economic levels in together, to wit, yuppies-to-be still in graduate school (Walking distance to campus notwithstanding, I hate my current suburban accommodations!), couples who want to offer an urban upbringing to their children.

Is that the same Michael Lewyn of "Why Sprawl is a Conservative Issue"? I do hope so!" It's a fantastic piece.


"But all things being equal, it’s worth keeping in mind what when progressives talk about fighting sprawl and incentivizing re-urbanization, they’re often talking about making it vastly more expensive to raise kids the way most Americans want to raise them."

As Lewyn's piece (http://www.repamerica.org/news/GEvol6/ge6.1_sprawl1.html) eloquently contends, conservatives, too, do and ought to fight sprawl.

Moreover, perhaps most Americans need to reconsider how they want to raise their children?

Notre Dame Professor of Architecture Phil Bess has a splendid piece on the New Urbanist Transect and Aristo-Thomism well worth the while for conservatives. http://64.143.51.61/Texts/The%20Polis%20and%20NL-Center%2015%20rev.pdf

Also, those houses ain't got no soul! They're the electronic drums of housing stock.

The point about the unaffordability of is something worth further consideration. I'm currently in a graduate program in urban planning, and for all the talk of the benefits of mixed-use design (which I wholly support), no one seems to have any substantial answers to the questions not only about keeping situation those whom gentrification stands to push out, but also about how to "gentrify" in a way that brings people of various economic levels in together, to wit, yuppies-to-be still in graduate school (Walking distance to campus notwithstanding, I hate my current suburban accommodations!), couples who want to offer an urban upbringing to their children.

Yikes, so sorry about the multiple posts!


If I were a grave-digger or even a hangman, there are some people I could
work for with a great deal of enjoyment.
-- Douglas Jerrold


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://xanga.com/joaquinburtonwc


Copyright © 2008 by The Atlantic Monthly Group. All rights reserved.