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Notes Toward a Definition of Conservatism

11 Jun 2008 03:08 pm

Two weeks ago, I proferred my definition of (American) conservatism:

...A commitment to the defense of the particular habits, mores and institutions of the United States against those socioeconomic trends that threaten to undermine them, and those political movements (generally on the left, but sometimes on the right) that seek to change them radically in the pursuit of particular ideological goals.

Last week, Tyler Cowen proposed an emendation, for the following reason:

I should not speak for Ross but having read his blog for a while I believe he would prefer a modified definition to allow some of those habits and mores to be judged. Ross circa 1958 for instance need not defend segregation.

And here's his proposed revision:

A realization that we will do best by building on the strengths of the particular habits, mores and institutions of the United States (and other successful nations) rather than trying to reshape the nation radically in the pursuit of particular ideological goals.

I'm of two minds about this critique. On the one hand, yes, I would like my definition of conservatism to allow space for opposition to segregation circa 1958 within its parameters, and in that sense I'm favorably inclined toward Tyler's revision. On the other hand, one of the things I like about my definition is precisely its narrowness and lack of specific ideological content - or put another way, I like the fact that it deliberately doesn't attempt to encompass every political belief that I consider correct, and every political movement that I like to think I would have supported, had I been alive to do so. This is why I'm not all that taken with, say, Russell Kirk's famous ten pillars of conservatism: Not because I disagree with them, exactly, but because they seem like an attempt to define the conservative as one who supports all that is Good and disdains all that is Bad. (I can imagine almost anyone, save a nihilist or a self-proclaimed revolutionary, claiming Kirk's pillars as the basis of their political philosophy, which makes them somewhat less than useful as a tool for taxonomizing political debates.)

With this mind, I think there's something to be said for simply conceding that support for segregation - as deep-rooted and "conservative" an institution as has ever existed in America, in a sense - simply was the conservative position in the 1950s, and that the liberals were right that the injustice of the practice required a deeply un-conservative response, as they have been right (and will be right again) on other points as well. Having conceded this, I would go on to argue that self-identifying as a conservative, under my definition, doesn't require taking the conservative position on every issue; it merely requires taking the conservative orientation as one's general approach to politics, and believing that we've reached a pass where America's distinctive "habits, mores and institutions" are more in need of defense then renovation. So you could call yourself a conservative in the 1950s and support the forcible rooting-out of segregation - you would simply be a conservative on most questions, and a liberal on that one. (Though to the extent that opposition to segregation came to dominate your political worldview, and determine your voting behavior, self-identifying as a conservative might become something of a stretch no matter what your other views.)

I should also note that my views on how to define conservatism are colored by my allegiance to Christianity, which unless you expand the Kirkian definition to the breaking point only tends to be a conservative force in societies that are already deeply permeated by Christian beliefs - and even then not necessarily. This means that I take it as a given that I wouldn't have been able to self-define as a conservative in second-century Rome, or sixteenth-century Japan, and I don't have all that much trouble saying that I wouldn't have self-defined as a conservative in 1950s Alabama either - which was one of those Christianity-permeated societies, I might add, where the Christian religion turned out to be something other than a conservative force. Nor do I have much trouble with the notion that depending on the trajectory 21st-century America takes, by the time I'm an old man I may not really be able to self-identify as a conservative either; I'm not a "reactionary radical" today, but on certain issues (abortion, for instance) that's probably a better description of my point of view than "conservative," and by 2060 it may apply to my views more generally.

Comments (47)

seems to combine 'pick and choose' with 'have my cake and eat it'.

Douthat: "and I don't have all that much trouble saying that I wouldn't have self-defined as a conservative in 1950s Alabama either"

actually, it seems to me you probably would have been.

Does conservatism really need a mission statement? In any event, I thought conservatism was, in part, devoted to not continuing to build up various institutions, but trust more to indivdual free will, at least in the economic sphere.

Of course, that's not very Sam's Club, but I find that Buchnananite project of yours misguided.

Ross,

No amendment of your original definition was necessary. When you wrote:

"A commitment to the defense of the particular habits, mores and institutions of the United States against those socioeconomic trends that threaten to undermine them, and those political movements (generally on the left, but sometimes on the right) that seek to change them radically in the pursuit of particular ideological goals."

it seems to me you were writing with the present in mind; that definition - like any proper definition of conservatism - has a certain place and a certain time in mind. In principle, it is as necessary for you to distance yourself from the "conservative" part of the Chinese Communist Party as it is to distance yourself from past conservative's support of segregation. You said nothing about supporting segregation; and since there is no segregation in the US today, your definition implies no support for it.

"In a progressive country change is constant; and the great question is not whether you should resist change which is inevitable, but whether that change should be carried out in deference to the manners, the customs, the laws and the traditions of a people, or whether it should be carried out in deference to abstract principles, and arbitrary and general doctrines."
Benjamin Disraeli, Speech in Edinburgh (1867)

support for segregation... simply was the conservative position in the 1950s... I would go on to argue that self-identifying as a conservative, under my definition, doesn't require taking the conservative position on every issue;

That's extremely important. No philosophy or orientation provides a correct response to every possible situation. That's why a healthy US has a liberal party and a conservative party.

it merely requires taking the conservative orientation as one's general approach to politics, and believing that we've reached a pass where America's distinctive "habits, mores and institutions" are more in need of defense then renovation.

How did you arrive at that conclusion? I wonder if this determination isn't more a matter of psychology, of predisposition, than philosophy.

I'm pretty inclined to defend the status quo, and believe that the people presented as being serious on TV are actually serious. (Maybe it's because I'm an oldest child, from a relatively comfortable, intact family). That's part of why I supported the Iraq invasion. But it's hard for me to see why, with that orientation, I would have supported ending segregation (or ending slavery, or creating Social Security).

Maybe if I'd been born elsewhere, I'd be predisposed to see the gap between rich and poor (in the US or worldwide), or the conditions of factory farms, or our educational systems, as being in a state of crisis, requiring rapid, transformative action. But I'll probably land on my feet, given the connections and education that were my birthright. Why be in a rush to mess around with things?

Ross:

Why does "taking the conservative orientation as one's general approach to politic" require "believing that we've reached a pass where America's distinctive 'habits, mores and institutions' are more in need of defense then renovation"? That puts a great deal of stress on your proper understanding of your society's current condition, of this zeit and its peculiar geist. Which seems at the same time intellectually risky, unnecessary, and not much like you.

Why isn't it enough to say: *every* society - including Alabama in 1958 - needs both conservatives and liberals, and I (Ross Douthat) am temperamentally suited to the conservative side of the ledger. I'm humble enough to realize that sometimes I'll be wrong, and flexible enough to realize that sometimes I have to abandon my conservative instincts for either a liberal or a "reactionary radical" position. I don't know whether I'd have been wise and moral enough to be against segregation in Alabama in 1958 (or 1948, or 1898) or whether I'd have stood by Jim Crow until the matter was taken out of my hands. But I'm willing to live with that uncertainty because I know that both liberal and conservative instincts can go morally astray, and there is no political philosophy that will ensure me against siding with evil at some point. But basically I'm a conservative because that's how my mind and heart are constituted.

Isn't that more correct to how you feel?

raft quotes and writes: "Douthat: "and I don't have all that much trouble saying that I wouldn't have self-defined as a conservative in 1950s Alabama either"

actually, it seems to me you probably would have been."

No question about it. Ross's mentor and swimming buddy William F. Buckley, after all, was an unabashed white supremacist at that time. Ross and his bosom buddy Steve Sailer are, even today, engaged in the sort of regressive dialogue on race that would have made the Buckley of 1958 proud.

Moe,

Has Ross, actually, expressed any racist opinions? Of course Buckley was a segregationist back in the '50s, you won't find me making any excuses for him. But I'm not sure it's fair to say the same of Ross. Perhaps if he lived in the 1950s he wouldn't have defined himself as a conservative at all.

You can't set up this definition

"A commitment to the defense of the particular habits, mores and institutions of the United States against those socioeconomic trends that threaten to undermine them"

and then give yourself an out on segregation, arguably the biggest 'trend' of the past fifty years.

Tyler's is more workable, since it does not assume the status quo as de facto correct. Indeed, if conservatism works in part on the assumption of human nature as fallible, than it follows that the existing structures and institutions will, to some degree, be fallible also, and so actually need moderate change to be maintained.

But the weaseling out of certain spots where history has been decided against the conversative position is pretty suspect. And the Christian 'bit' aside, a Roman conservative would have (rightly) seen Christianity as a hugely undermining force.

Hector asks: "Has Ross, actually, expressed any racist opinions?"

I think his "welfare duchess" blog item sure counts. And his continued linking to Steve Sailer is more evidence.

Here, I chased down the welfare duchess piece. Rereading it now it seems even worse than it did then.

http://rossdouthat.theatlantic.com/archives/2007/12/the_myth_of_welfare_queens.php

With this mind, I think there's something to be said for simply conceding that support for segregation - as deep-rooted and "conservative" an institution as has ever existed in America, in a sense

There were antebellum statutes that prohibited the settlement of free negroes in certain territories (i.e. Illinois) and the 'black codes' in place in Southern states during the run of years from 1865-68, but the statutes which created separate school systems and designated areas in public accommodations were put in place in the years running from about 1877 to about 1914. There were old men in Alabama in 1958 who could remember a period antedating legally-enforced segregation, and such laws were in force only in the South and a few other states (e.g. Indiana). (If I am not mistaken, it was the thesis of C. Vann Woodward's The Strange Career of Jim Crow that the institution it self was not particularly venerable and that various approaches to race relations had been attempted in the generation after the Civil War).

[segregationism] simply was the conservative position in the 1950s, and that the liberals were right that the injustice of the practice required a deeply un-conservative response, as they have been right (and will be right again) on other points as well.

Among the opponents of segregation in the 1950s were Claire Boothe Luce and Richard Nixon.

There were federalist, libertarian, legal-positivist, and parochialist critiques of the set of court decrees and statutes which dismantled segregation in the years running from 1954 to 1968. The principles invoked were less bound to time and place than were the apologias for Southern caste regulations. You could argue that the situation was such in Mississippi and other places that the people who offered these critiques were being rather bloodless, but they did identify antecedently some of the unhappy sequelae of what was going on at that time.

My definition of a conservative is someone who thinks these two people needed to be split up at all costs:

http://www.slate.com/id/2192178/

Moe,

I would say that Ross, in that post, was being cruel, uncharitable, and callous, and I hope he's thought better of it since then. (I've been all three of those things on occasion of course). I would not, however, necessarily say that he was being a racist. He might well have exhibited the same reaction if the subject of the article was a white lady on welfare in Portland.

Correction: Ms. Jaspers wasn't on welfare, she was in subsidized housing. My point still stands.

So you could call yourself a conservative in the 1950s and support the forcible rooting-out of segregation - you would simply be a conservative on most questions, and a liberal on that one.

You neglect the intermediate zone of opinion that stood between a defense of Southern caste regulations as they stood and the social policies adopted by the federal government after 1953, which might have found expression thus:

1. Replacement of parallel school systems with open-enrollment;

2. Superintendency of a selection of local police departments and boards of elections vy federal trustees;

3. An end to commercial and labor regulations which required private parties to provide separate facilities.

4. Removal of caste regulations in public buildings and transit.

5. Replacement of haphazard assigned counsel plans with state or federal public defenders and legal aid bureaux.

Again, Ross gets the benefit of the doubt, while people who post comments generally assume the worse of the other commentators.

The garbage he's posted the past week alone makes me highly skeptical that welfare queen post was an aberration.

No, I can't be right. Ross is a highly moral person. He says so. Often.

I would say that Ross, in that post, was being cruel, uncharitable, and callous,

The Welfare Duchess will get over it, and so should you.

Hector replies: "I would not, however, necessarily say that he was being a racist. He might well have exhibited the same reaction if the subject of the article was a white lady on welfare in Portland."

I prefer to form opinions based on what people do rather than based on what they "might well have" done. And given the fact that he was, at the same time, defending Saint Reagan's blatantly racist "welfare queens in Cadillacs" horseshit, I stand by my opinion.

It was also nice that Ross should use as means of highlighting excess government resources going to unneedy sources by picking a story in New Orleans.

If he's like this in 2008, I really don't know why he thinks he would have been so anti segregation in 1958.

Oh right, he doesn't. He's just full of shit.

I've been pretty critical of Ross's latest string of posts, so in the interest of fairness and not wanting to be seen as trolling, as some here clearly are, I should say I thought that was a pretty fair post.

Art Deco quotes and replies: "I would say that Ross, in that post, was being cruel, uncharitable, and callous,

The Welfare Duchess will get over it, and so should you."

Artie sent a card to Amadou Diallo's family saying exactly the same thing.

Jeff says: "I should say I thought that was a pretty fair post."

If you're talking about his "welfare duchess" post, you should know that at the time I checked (and posted information from) the New Orleans area Craigslist, where it turned out you could buy a TV like the "duchess" had for as little as $150.

Some "fairness." Some "duchess."

In other words, American conservatism is "I got mine, Jack. You can go pound sand."

I've often wondered how this version of conservatism meshes with the Christian doctrine of taking care of the least of us. Is it that the State is not supposed to play any role in charity?

yes, I would like my definition of conservatism to allow space for opposition to segregation circa 1958

Wow, that's might white of you.

I would submit that a definition of conservatism fails to have much ... depth, until the author of it can also offer one of progressivism or liberalism.

The notion that Christianity is linked with a particular civil order or political philosophy ... is not obvious, historically or theologically.

Here, let me try something perhaps more directly provocative:

"In the end, conservatism is ultimately a philosophy of managed despair, not Hope and certainly not Freedom.

In the conservative mindset, what we have is all there is, more often than not.

We surrender our "freedoms" to the highly emphasized threats from the few - from criminals, from rogues, including rogue nations.

We further surrender our freedom to the base, to the least common denominator among institutions, to the least regulated market economy, because, if we do not, someone else will."

Surely Ross secretly embraces the real definition of conservatism:

Do nothing, see nothing, think nothing. For this is the best of all possible worlds, and we must cultivate our garden.

Of course, conservatism today is one vast fraud, and functions only as a club for self-hating gay men, self-abusing anorexic women, and sad white boys with large stomachs and nasty little minds. It has neither integrity, nor principle, and the results have been on display for the past 8 years.

Personally, I think Ross gave a reasonable, historical definition of conservatism here and was refreshingly honest about its drawbacks.

Now, it's not an accurate description of present-day Americans who self-identify as conservative --a group which includes "reactionary radicals", armchair imperialists, cringing xenophobes, crony capitalists, people who think the Left Behind books are nonfiction, neoconfederate scum, people who sell Obama monkey dolls, and plenty of others who are primarily interested in reshaping the mores and of the United States to make them cruder and dumber and/or using our public institutions to enrich themselves.

But as far as the straightforward ideological component of conservatism goes, "building on the strengths of the particular habits, mores and institutions of the United States (and other successful nations) rather than trying to reshape the nation radically" is a fair definition. I'd substitute the word "peculiar" for "particular", though.

Jeff and LaFollette,

It's not this specific post, although there are huge problems with it, not least asking for an out on segregation, and somehow assuming you would be a Christian if you had been born in a time and place when it was regarded similar to Scientology now.

It's that the post makes moral claims, wrapped then in religion and high-mindedness, which are completely undermined when you look at Ross's posts when it comes down to specifics.

Vitter for President is an astonishing recent post, but you look over the course of the work, and just a few examples:

the delightful 'welfare duchess' Moe dug up, an essay which essentially states that Nixon was the best president you could have hoped for in that period, and trying to somehow blame it on people being into music and culture, and you have the Bush legacy posts.

When he's being abstract, he sounds high minded and moral. When it comes down to specifics, virtually without exception, he's completely partisan.

If it was exclusively one or the other, fine. But he gets a pass on the partisan because he is forever going on about how bloody moral he is. It's one of the oldest tricks, and I'm surprised that so few of the The Atlantic readers seem to see it.

Seems like a fairly reasonable attempt to define conservative, along with a pretty reasonable admission that the effort becomes deeply problematic and limited when it tries to tackle the specifics. Worse than that, with all the exceptions, it just becomes sort of vague.

Why not just say that you prefer some traditions and not others, for a host of different reasons? Or stick with the more flexible conservative principle that we should never underestimate the power and importance of tradition and social stability: while many traditions may be wrong, we should appreciate why they are the way they are and what sorts of other consequences might come from changing them too radically.

28 Feb 2008 11:00 am
"There’s no question that Buckley’s mid-century moral blindness about race and civil rights – a blindness shared by most if not all conservatives at the time"

11 Jun 2008 03:08 pm
"So you could call yourself a conservative in the 1950s and support the forcible rooting-out of segregation"

I think James has expressed exactly what I've been thinking.

I'd just add that Ross' comment about what a conservative might believe:

"...and believing that we've reached a pass where America's distinctive "habits, mores and institutions" are more in need of defense then renovation."

was stated better, and in fewer words by Buckley:

"Standing athwart history and yelling 'stop!'".

Barry,

That's fine, but you either yell stop, or you accept some things need to be changed. You don't get to be a retrospective traffic light on things that turned out to be wrong.

And using Buckley when Ross is trying to duck the segregation part isn't that helpful to his cause.

Man, it's great to be able to define your political outlook as: a commitment to establishing law on best rational grounds.

Maybe extant practices are based on those grounds, maybe not, but bias either way on that question strikes me as, well, unreasoning. Look, we all have our biases--we're all "temperamental" somethings or other. Ross likes the familiar, I like the novel. But the very qualifier itself calls out its non-rational character. Taking one's temperament, working it up into a statement of political principle, and then legislating on that basis, is bonkers.

Man, it's great to be able to define your political outlook as: a commitment to establishing law on best rational grounds.

Pretending we really know enough to do that, and shouldn't pay prudent heed to presumption, precedent, tradition, and stability even if we think they might be wrong is a sign of great irrationality. Thinking you know enough to make rational choices often marks you as an arrogant jerk, not to mention, well, irrational.

Good scientists (I hope I'm one on my better days) know just how little they know.

So outlawing abortion, remaking the world through preventive invasions intending to shape governments to our liking, privatizing Social Security, etc. would not be "conservative" by Ross's definition; they would be (reactionary) radical.

I agree.

I'm not sure what major positions Republicans have taken in recent years *would* be classified as "conservative," however. I'm also scratching my head to define any of John McCain's major positions as "conservative."

Bottom line: both Democrats and Republican leaders want to shake up the status quo. There's not a "conservative" in the bunch.

On a side note, I'm impressed by Ross's increasing suppleness. One is a conservative unless there's something one really wants to change, like the law on abortion. One promotes family values unless it conflicts with something else one wants, like electing McCain over Obama. Awesome!

I've often wondered how this version of conservatism meshes with the Christian doctrine of taking care of the least of us. Is it that the State is not supposed to play any role in charity?

Catholic Social Teachings as they have been elaborated since Rerum Novarum have tended to favor a principle of "subsidiarity", an aspect of which is that the institutions of state are meant to assist the work of more particular, natural, and voluntary association (e.g. the family and benevolent societies) but are to assume no function that can be adequately performed by them.

I would submit that a definition of conservatism fails to have much ... depth, until the author of it can also offer one of progressivism or liberalism.

If you follow Mr. Esper's link above you will see that one of his bullet points is Sodomy for the Senile.

Of course, conservatism today is one vast fraud, and functions only as a club for self-hating gay men, self-abusing anorexic women, and sad white boys with large stomachs and nasty little minds. It has neither integrity, nor principle, and the results have been on display for the past 8 years.

Thanks for sharing.

The idea that ideology is somehow the exclusive province of the left is totally absurd. As Zizek points out, even the design of our toilets is ideoligical.

Conservative deference to national, religious, familial traditions is entirely ideological. The flag is ideological. Marriage is ideological. Religion is ideological. The state itself is ideological. The state, the nuclear family and so forth are not an organic institution that sprang out of the Great Rift Valley with Australopithecus. Marriage today is a radically different institution that it was five thousand, five hundred, and even fifty years ago. The same goes for the family, the city, the nation, etc.

All of the right's political projects (ALL OF THEM) are ideological. The grotesque and dangerous idea of post-ideological politics was one of the lamer fads of the 1990s. I blame Tony Blair, Bill Clinton, and the East Asian technocracies.

If you follow Mr. Esper's link above you will see that one of his bullet points is Sodomy for the Senile.

Art, there are two types of people in this world, really. There are people who are happy that two old people have found each other and a little bit of pleasure in their waning years, and there are people who think it's their business to make fun of them and belittle them and use the government and social pressure to stop them from enjoying that pleasure.

The latter are called "conservatives".

I guess I'm not a conservative, because I find Dilan's little story sad but certainly don't feel moved to belittle these folks or use any government or social pressure against them. I think the nursing home is within reason to try to stop the public sex aspects, and I imagine Dilan thinks so too. What a weird definition of conservative!

Marquis, I think that's a respectable and humane comment. And I agree, it's perfectly reasonable for the home to enforce rules against this sort of conduct in public areas.

But you will notice Art Deco's response, above. And the reality is that there are plenty of social conservatives who are so hung up on the fact that these two people are not married to each other and are engaging in a type of sex that they disapprove of that they would agree with Art Deco.

My broader point is that a lot of this stuff really isn't any of our business (or isn't the business of government), and the conservtive movement has (perhaps for tactical reasons) endorsed the viewpoint of the religiously-motivated minority which thinks that it is.

Obviously, that isn't the definition of a conservative-- I was being sarcastic-- but it gets at one reason why the conservative movement is up the creek.